When you revert to your normal form, you return to the number of hit Keep in mind that the state of the meta periodically changes as new source materials are released, and the article will be updated accordingly as time allows. A disintegrated creature and everything it is wearing and carrying, except magic items, are reduced to a pile of fine gray dust. What is considered a class feature for a monster for the purpose of Change Shape? You turn back into a lvl 17+ Wizard. You assume the form of a different creature for the duration. Shapechange Vs True Polymorph - Tips & Tactics - D&D Beyond You also maintain your mental ability scores, which is a slightly double-edged sword but at least means youre not going to hose yourself if you do turn into something dumb and burly. The creature can't be a construct or an undead, and you must have seen the sort of creature at least once. Does Disintegrate reduce the a Polymorphed target to dust first or does the creature revert to its regular form first? When you revert to your normal form, you return to the number of hit points you had before you transformed. It reverts to its true form if it dies. We will not include 3rd-party content, including content from DMs Guild, in handbooks for official content because we cant assume that your game will allow 3rd-party content or homebrew. Why refined oil is cheaper than cold press oil? When an Adult Gold Dragon changes into an Archmage, what are its saving throw and skill bonuses? There's a lot of differences between shapechange and polymorph. document.getElementById("ak_js_1").setAttribute("value",(new Date()).getTime()); DnD 5e New Practical Guide to True Polymorph and Shapechange, Practical Guide to True Polymorph and Shapechange DnD 5e. A disintegrated creature and everything it is wearing and carrying, except magic items, are reduced to a pile of fine gray dust. @JeremyECrawford What happens if a wild shaped druid is reduced to 0 by disintegrate? Immediate vagueness problems. The GM determines whether it is practical for the new form to wear a piece of equipment, based on the creature's shape and size. Shapechange - Spells - D&D Beyond The change shape feature of the Brass dragon says (emphasis mine): The dragon magically polymorphs into a humanoid or beast that has a challenge rating no higher than its own. Now, in terms of power, neither True Polymorph nor 5e's version of Shapechange hold a candle to Wish. You can get A Monster for Every Season: Summer 2 now at Gumroad, Started work on a 5E OGL SRD game that might get released on Drivethrurpg.com, http://www.sageadvice.eu/2014/10/11/rue-polymorph/, The Fighter (redesigned with more than swinging a weapon in mind, uses inspiration dice), The Thug (Hybrid Barbarian/Rogue) ver. This is to represent that youre turning into a normal creature of that type, not one with additional training. Learn more about Stack Overflow the company, and our products. My bad on this one, I set the wizard testing polymorph to the wrong skill level. There are several things that posters in this thread don't seem to realize about True Polymorph: that would likely become a DM discretion thing. Depending on how you have treated it. What a fun clause to start yet another argument with this spell. High level transmutation magic offers some of the most tempting and easily abusable magic available. Not a gimme, but absolutely passable. If the creature has the same proficiency as you and the bonus listed in its statistics is higher than yours, use the creatures bonus in place of yours. This inherits all of the issues with any kind of creature from the first section but Im not going to list them again. This allows you to do some interesting cheese where you cast a Contingency Dispel Magic and say When I think unmorph me of my own free will, cast Dispel Magic to target the True Polymorph running on me, then live for up to just shy of 10 days as an Ancient Brass Dragon, flip to human for a moment, and go back to being a dragon. at 0 hit points for the purposes of an effect like disintegrate until We also wont cover Unearthed Arcana content because its not finalized, and we cant guarantee that it will be available to you in your games. Disintegrate and Polymorph both have effects that happen when the subject is reduced to 0 hit points. The entire basis of the Disintegrate spell is to turn something to ash, and there doesn't seem to be anything in the polymorph spell that would counter that or stop the disintegration. Would it be possible to only half transform into a monster? Essentially, a druid like this would be able to stay shapechanged -indefinitely-. It retains its alignment and personality. It doesnt fix what happens when you choose Brass Dragon though. Shapechange states that you turn into a typical example of the creature withoutthe Spellcasting trait, but Crawford has confirmed on twitter that you would keep your ability to cast your own spells because that comes from your class features. The consent submitted will only be used for data processing originating from this website. Its statistics, other than its size, are the same in each form. Shapechange is more of a solo-featured spell while True Polymorph can affect others in the party and allow you to change objects and creatures. by Tarven Sat Jul 07, 2012 7:13 pm, Post It might just be easier to balance the skill levels between the two spells and make them identical, its not canon but we are not unknown for compromising in the name of balance. So then. a lvl 20 can potentially shapechange into an Ancient Brass Dragon. given that they've seen one before? Fortunately, Crawford specified that you cant. True Polymorph Concentration Level 9th Casting Time 1 Action Range/Area 30 ft Components V, S, M * Duration Concentration 1 Hour School Transmutation Attack/Save WIS Save Damage/Effect Buff (.) the druid, not the beast form, drops to 0 hp. Since all other creatures die at 0 HP (unless the DM makes a special case to have them follow PC rules) that shouldn't influence the above. This spell transforms a creature that you can see within range into a new form. Was going to say that I don't think you can take class levels after you TP, but I forgot entirely about the Clone spell. Worn equipment functions as normal. Don't know why I didn't process the 'truesight' reference in the spell description and assumed it was complete/redundant. Shapechange vs True Polymorph Question : r/dndnext - Reddit If you want to support your answer as written, suggest you refer to the sage advice compendium, page 14, since JCrawford covered both cases in that SA final draft. Unfortunately, thats unlikely to change unless WotC gets really into more dire whatevers since the Tyrannosaurus is generally considered the biggest, chompiest dinosaur. Additionally, with both of these spells, Legendary Resistance is a perfectly valid tool you gain access to. If you turn a creature into another kind of creature, the new form can be any kind you choose whose challenge rating is equal to or less than the targets (or its level, if the target doesnt have a challenge rating). DnD 5e - Practical Guide to Polymorph | RPGBOT As long as the excess damage doesn't reduce your normal form to 0 hit points, you aren't knocked unconscious. How does polymorph work? It does mean you dont get the full benefit out of, for example, Shapechanging into a pit fiend and using the Charisma of 24 to power your Bard spells, although thats still a very good idea since they can clearly speak and have hands for somatic components on top of a pile of other great benefits. The creature can be restored to life only by means of a true resurrection or a wish spell. A difficult CR. Keep in mind that nothing prevents the wizard from making his clone in case he dies while in his TP form. Now, if we again look to the specifics of this spell versus True Polymorph, then this would seem to imply that, given that you cant use lair or legendary actions when you Shapechange, you can when you True Polymorph. I definitely see the argument there. Should they change the rules or release something 'official' in regards to this, then I would abide by that, but at the end of the day, it still all comes down to what the individual DM decides works or doesn't work. The 3.5 Shapechange Handbook - giantitp.com We also know that creatures under the effects of Polymorph, True Polymorph, or Shapechange, have essentially a large well of temp HP, which when they reach 0HP . ", @Kashir on page 14 of SA compendium Crawford provides a RAI and RAW PoV, which is why I have two answers. However, if the target within the antimagic field hits 0 hit points, or otherwise dies, the effect of True Polymorph would end should their body be removed from the antimagic field. Next paragraph: The targets gear melds into the new form. #3 Feb 8, 2022 EurobeatJester View User Profile View Posts Nothing will happen on this front until the basic polymorph code is fixed to address some of the mechanisms by which it is unbalancing and/or subject to abuse. And that particular cat form, if it's the one I'm thinking - it stops working at level 43 because, according to the race file, it recieves massive stat boosts at that level, becoming essentially a dire form. While True Polymorph allows any creature, Polymorph only allows beasts, so this section will analyze available beast forms. If you revert as a result of You transform the creature into a different creature, the creature into a nonmagical object, or the object into a creature (the object must be neither worn nor carried by another creature). Manage Settings (Later printings state instead that "The spell has no effect on a shapechanger".) When exactly does a concentration spell end from casting another one? (Taken from the Disintegrate spell) If it reverts as a result of dropping to 0 hit points, any excess damage carries over to its normal form. You cant use any legendary actions or lair actions of the new form. You lose class abilities, feats, racial traits, etc. If I use magic to see a pit fiend in a dream (with the Dream spell), does that count? by Tarven Sat Jul 07, 2012 5:29 pm, Post So if I'm understanding right: Disintegrate could replace the 0 HP trigger and thus insta-kill morphed creatures, or Polymorph would have precedence. You could also True Polymorph someone else, and they would be free to polymorph into something else. You can argue RAI being for polymorph and the second pool of HP (which is a benefit of those spells and abilities) taking precedence. Equipment that merges has no effect in that state. Shapechange Vs. Polymorph - Forgotten Kingdoms Forums True polymorph changes you once and that's it. How does everyone play True seeing? I think it goes off of the players total level, so in your example, they would be able to become a CR 20. depends on the DM's decision of whether they would be considered a construct or something more unique I suppose. You assume the hit points and Hit Dice of the new form. Choose one creature or non-magical object that you can see within range. Worth noting is that shapechange -does- last longer than polymorph currently(EDIT: It doesn't. Connect and share knowledge within a single location that is structured and easy to search. As writen, it does not say you cannot use a creatures legendary saves, but it does say you cannot use its legendary actions or lair actions. Dont consider combat forms from CR 0; there are better options available the moment you get Polymorph. Wild Shape also comes into the game much earlier than those spells. Dungeons & Dragons, D&D, their respective logos, and all Wizards titles and characters are property of Wizards of the Coast LLC in the U.S.A. and other countries. As long as the excess damage doesnt reduce the creatures normal form to 0 hit points, it isnt knocked unconscious., Nothing particularly noteworthy here. Use In-Game Forum commands to activate your forum account, It is currently Mon May 01, 2023 11:12 pm, We can put them in a helpfile and also keep them available on the, Time for the ability/skill should be increased. To address your edit: Concentration is not a class feature of spellcasting classes. Apparently, RAI is in opposition to my other answer. Monstrous Compendium Vol 3: Minecraft Creatures, * - (a jade circlet worth at least 1,500 gp, which you must place on your head before you cast the spell). @NautArch That's correct. Once you understand how the spell works the most important decision you make is what form to select. I support this - I'd like to see duration and possible forms changed to SRD. As soon as you begin casting the second spell, the first breaks and its effects, including your new form, end. How do I stop the Flickering on Mode 13h? by Althasizor Sat Jul 07, 2012 4:26 pm, Post or b) The body polymorphs back into its original form, then it disintegrates. If you're concentrating on one spell, and you cast another concentration spell, when exactly does the first spell end? And true polymorph allow changing creatures into objects and vice versa. Mearles has stated time and time again his responses is how *he* would rule it. You can't concentrate on two spells at once, at all: ". A creature must be designatedwith a tag or other textas a shapechanger to count as one. What is the symbol (which looks similar to an equals sign) called? Dont expect the target to do math or make tactical decisions. Shapechange trait from something like a dopplganger says; The doppelganger can use its action to polymorph into a Small or Medium humanoid it has seen, or back into its true form. Would being ordered to fight be better or worse? You lose access to your former class features while True Polymorphed. The GM has the creatures statistics and resolves all of its actions and movement. It only takes a minute to sign up. Wizards of the Coast LLC. Improving the copy in the close modal and post notices - 2023 edition, New blog post from our CEO Prashanth: Community is the future of AI. What happens when a Polymorphed creature is reduced to 0 HP by It seems this was errataed to be the other way around; from Sage Compendium (p. 13): "What happens if a druid using Wild Shape is reduced to 0 hit points by disintegrate ? Keep in mind that the lowest level you will be able to cast Polymorph is level 7, so you generally wont look for combat forms below CR 7. Dragon Breath Weapons are NOT a guarantee to drop this because you forget that you can save for 1/2. That's my take on it, though I will point out that Jeremy Crawford is a D&D dev. The creature cant be a construct or an undead, and you must have seen the sort of creature at least once. RPGBOT contributing author and podcast co-host Random Powell is back with another exciting article, this time hey wait a minute, I can just write these myself. What happens if a sorcerer is hit with Disintegrate while he has turned into a potted plant? I seem to recall that matters. What if, again, its a golem that you ordered to protect something and it sat for an hour doing absolutely nothing? It says monsters can take class levels in the DMG. When true polymorphed creature dies, does it revert to its original form? Per @Airatome's comment on Mr Crawford's tweet: I can't find a way to bring up the ENTIRE conversation, but it was noted this applies to Polymorph target's as well. But what about their personality? The advice offered below is based on the current State of the Character Optimization Meta as of when the article was last updated. @JeremyECrawford D&D 5E Problems with Polymorph, True Polymorph, and Shapechange - EN World Its certainly simpler. It seems odd that wild shape is replaced by shapechange as a druid ability, when shapechange is a powered up version of polymorph for druids and wizards according to D20. Druid rev2023.5.1.43405. It might remain friendly to you, depending on how you have treated it. This site works best with JavaScript enabled. Wild Shape lasts longer and you always have the option to switch out to something else, unlike polymorph. I know that True Polymorph is a Concentration spell, so the first True Polymorph would end when they cast the second one, I don't think they lose the spell they're Concentrating on if they lose the Spellcasting feature that gave them the slot in the first place? The spellcaster level is also used for any cantrips included in the feature. the druid, not the beast form, drops to 0 hp. Shapechanging, Available For: What are the best True Polymorph forms? - giantitp.com It acts on each of your turns. It uses this ability to turn into a CR 12 Archmage, which has the Spellcasting feature, allowing it to cast spells using as an 18th level spellcaster, using its intelligence score. All of this detail diving violates KISS principle, which is why I tried to focus on the "spell effect" and its unusual " and your equipment too" detail as significant. Your game statistics are replaced by the statistics of the chosen creature, though you retain your alignment and Intelligence, Wisdom, and Charisma scores. ); Just not at the hour a level suggested here. Does the Way of the Long Death monk's Mastery of Death feature protect against the Disintegrate spell? The creature cant activate, use, wield, or otherwise benefit from any of its equipment. This one is a little disappointing because Shapechange is way more generous about what you can do with your gear if you cast it on yourself, but given that this is also supposed to function as Uber Baleful Polymorph I guess it makes sense that you wouldnt want to let the person youre turning into a standard turtle continue wearing their Robe of the Archmagi. Can a Wizard polymorph low-level PCs into over-powered beasts? Like a summon. CR 0 has better scout and disable forms, and nothing here is useful as a combat form. result of dropping to 0 hit points, any excess damage carries over to Random Powell. Which reverse polarity protection is better and why? drop to 0 hit points. JavaScript is disabled. Before you read this guide, read the Polymorph spell description on the 5e SRD. added, Joshua Maxman @Orethalion As long as the excess damage doesnt reduce your normal Your scouting and combat forms may change as new options become available, but since your disable form should generally be CR 0 it probably wont change much. You can however keep using True Polymorph to turn into various creatures with spell slots, and exhaust them all. Is there any known 80-bit collision attack? You can however keep using True Polymorph to turn into various creatures with spell slots, and exhaust them all. The druid turns to dust, since the spell disintegrates you the instant you drop to 0 hit points. The GM has the creatures statistics and resolves all of its actions and movement. You cant use any legendary actions or lair actions of the new form. You can only speak if the creature can normally speak. @Orethalion 2) You retain the benefits of any items or gear you're wearing when you transform - not so with TP. Adding EV Charger (100A) in secondary panel (100A) fed off main (200A). To subscribe to this RSS feed, copy and paste this URL into your RSS reader. Best creatures to turn into with true polymorph? : r/dndnext - Reddit Maxman You retain the benefit of any features from your class, race, or other source and can use them, provided that your new form is physically capable of doing so. Would the material component of this spell be replaced by a spell focus since it doesn't say that the circlet is consumed? For future readers' reference: the answer to this question changed due to the 2018 PHB errata, so the existing answers here may have been rendered inaccurate by the change. Role-playing Games Stack Exchange is a question and answer site for gamemasters and players of tabletop, paper-and-pencil role-playing games. ok, yep, so the definitions of Truesight and True Seeing are different. It turns out we are both wrong. What happens to the target of a "permanent" True Polymorph spell when its caster dies? A lich is an undead, not a humanoid or beast. This spell has no effect on a shapechanger or a creature with 0 hit points. It would be consistent to rule that no matter what shape change or polymorph power was being used, Disintegrate is a special case and the Specific beats General argument should prevail for it. You can turn an object into any kind of creature, as long as the creatures size is no larger than the objects size and the creatures challenge rating is 9 or lower. This links in to the "what happens when you are reduced to 0 HP" rule. 6:20 PM - 16 Sep 2015. You could also True Polymorph someone else, and they would be free to polymorph into something else. You retain the benefit of any features from your class, race, or other source and can use them, provided that your new form is physically capable of doing so. True Polymorph only lets you use the abilities of the thing you change into and you lose your race and class features while transformed. I would personally try to fall between the two but closer to the lax end (because this is a 9th level spell and the game left the rails behind long ago at that point). Because it turns out that hitting 0 hp as your new form will always end the spell on you, even if its been 1000 years of living as a dragon. Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0, TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History, Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News, Wildshape Interactions with Weird Racial Features, Ignore/Block Essentials, Paid Registrations by. Granted, if the carry over HP from disintegrate reaches your max HP total, the dead the PC will be. The Disintegrate result overwrites the "fall unconscious" effect for the targeted creature. The 4th level spell, Polymorph, explicitly only allows turning into beasts. The shapechange spell says you retain your class features and can use them if your new form is physically capable of doing so. The tension between the specific rules, over the general 0 HP rule, exists because Polymorph spells also overwrite unconscious because you don't fall unconscious when you revert to old form if the damage taken doesn't also exceed your normal HP. What were the most popular text editors for MS-DOS in the 1980s? All of the issue for those three spells leave the Wild Shape Druid class skill/ability open to "what level is that cast at?" Random's articles include the the Armor Artificer Handbook, the Hexblade Warlock Handbook, and the Practical Guide to Magical Secrets. So what level of authenticity is required? The description of the polymorph spell states that "A shapechanger automatically succeeds on this saving throw". Sorry, read the power wrong. This gets weird when we have multiple stat blocks, a la dragons. If we are going to follow SRD for almost everything as a standard, then we should adapt it for shape change. Change Shape: The dragon magically polymorphs into a humanoid or beast. If a dragon uses Change Shape to turn into an Evoker, does it gain/have the material components for its spells? Or at least thats what youd think, if you hadnt read this Sage Advice. I recently discovered that many people share my profound enthusiasm for turning things into other things which, combined with fantasizing about high level spells as one often does, led me to make a guide where I discussed some of the fantastic utility available using True Polymorph and Shapechange. According to Mearls: Mearles isn't even RAI for 5e. The intent is that a druid using Wild Shape is disintegrated if By clicking Accept all cookies, you agree Stack Exchange can store cookies on your device and disclose information in accordance with our Cookie Policy. Just because a form you take is capable of casting spells does not mean you can inherently cast any spells that arent part of that stat block. Does your DM need to know or decide by fiat the mean age category of all Brass Dragons out there? Please enable JavaScript to get the best experience from this site. We and our partners use data for Personalised ads and content, ad and content measurement, audience insights and product development. Do you lose Concentration upon beginning to cast a Concentration spell, or upon completing casting a Concentration spell? If you turn a creature into another kind of creature, the new form can be any kind you choose whose challenge rating is equal to or less than the targets (or its level, if the target doesnt have a challenge rating). ), its going to behave differently. As a kill spell, this is incredible functionality, although we run into suddenly needing to know things like how many hitpoints a 5ft cube of rock has because, once again, reducing the block to 0 hitpoints will end the spell. Any equipment it is wearing or carrying isn't transformed. When the spell states that you take the form of "any creature with a challenge rating equal to your level or lower", does this mean the players class level, spell-caster level, or total level from all classes. That's actually a perfect point and suddenly perma TP is valuable again. The advice offered below is based on the current State of the Character Optimization Meta as of when the article was last updated. your normal form. I have the idea that the "or dies" was for all other cases than PC, and the 0 HP was 'for all cases PC and those rare special NPC's that get to use the 0 HP rule." Each of these things is a specific difference and considering the WotC lawyer speak writing of spells and actions and the various errata that they change over time (learned over years of writing the rules on Magic cards), I do not believe there is an intent to be vague. If you revert as a result of dropping to 0 hit points, any excess damage carries over to your normal form. Now use the ghost to magically age the shadow dragon into an ancient gold shadow dragon. Who knows. Thats just basically a movie screen that a Scrying is playing on. If the null hypothesis is never really true, is there a point to using a statistical test without a priori power analysis? You dont gain any Spellcasting traits, but you do gain Innate Spellcasting traits. When you transform, you choose whether your equipment falls to the ground, merges into the new form, or is worn by it. A level 50 druid with 10 skill in shapechange obtains 2/3 of the duration as a level 50 wizard with 10 skill in polymorph. An example of data being processed may be a unique identifier stored in a cookie. Thus reaching 0 HP will cause you to revert as will death. The Polymorph spell is an extremely versatile and powerful tool. Thank you for your comment and welcome to RPG StackExchange. I'll correct my answer. You're also more than welcome to link to my handbook if you want extra information available in the shapechange spell description in yours. Can you get infinite spells through True Polymorph and Change Shape? * (a jade circlet worth at least 1,500 gp, which you must place on your head before you cast the spell). This answer favors Disintegrate because it bypasses, or renders null and void, considerations of the "unconscious" state at 0 HP. 1.0, How to break the game with Animal Messenger (starting at level 3), AMFES: Summer 2, Now with Digital Tokens Included, 2020 Holiday Ornament and Black Friday Sale, If this is your first visit, be sure to True polymorph and the dragon Change Shape feature According to the Polymorph spell description, death will revert you to your original form with your original HP (with extra damage carried over). You also retain all of your skill and saving throw proficiencies, in addition to gaining those of the creature. True polymorph and the dragon Change Shape feature. The hour a level being suggested here seems extreme to me, for the FK environment. dnd 5e - Can a polymorphed creature use class features that don't Parabolic, suborbital and ballistic trajectories all follow elliptic paths. Mighty villains and special nonplayer characters are common exceptions; the GM might have them fall unconscious and follow the same rules as player characters. The creature is limited in the actions it can perform by the nature of its new form, and it cant speak, cast spells, or take any other action that requires hands or speech, unless its new form is capable of such actions. Stack Exchange network consists of 181 Q&A communities including Stack Overflow, the largest, most trusted online community for developers to learn, share their knowledge, and build their careers. Yes, Disintegrate turns you to dust. I hardly consider turning into a monster permanently as cheese. What differentiates living as mere roommates from living in a marriage-like relationship?

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